Can One Who Has Sinned Be a Saint?

A discussion on a controversial point.

Can one who has sinned be a saint?

Sometimes people think that once a person has performed sinful acts, especially acts that are grievously sinful, he must be regarded as a sinner forever. This notion runs contrary to Vaishnava philosophy.

I am posting here the first of a series of quotations in this regard.

From Bhagavad-gita As It Is (9.30) by His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.

api cet su-duracaro
bhajate mam ananya-bhak
sadhur eva sa mantavyah
samyag vyavasito hi sah

api — even; cet — if; su-duracarah — one committing the most abominable actions; bhajate — is engaged in devotional service; mam — unto Me; ananya-bhak — without deviation; sadhuh — a saint; eva — certainly; sah — he; mantavyah — is to be considered; samyak — completely; vyavasitah — situated in determination; hi — certainly; sah — he.

Even if one commits the most abominable action, if he is engaged in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated in his determination.

PURPORT

The word su-duracarah used in this verse is very significant, and we should understand it properly. When a living entity is conditioned, he has two kinds of activities: one is conditional, and the other is constitutional. As for protecting the body or abiding by the rules of society and state, certainly there are different activities, even for the devotees, in connection with the conditional life, and such activities are called conditional. Besides these, the living entity who is fully conscious of his spiritual nature and is engaged in Krsna consciousness, or the devotional service of the Lord, has activities which are called transcendental. Such activities are performed in his constitutional position, and they are technically called devotional service. Now, in the conditioned state, sometimes devotional service and the conditional service in relation to the body will parallel one another. But then again, sometimes these activities become opposed to one another. As far as possible, a devotee is very cautious so that he does not do anything that could disrupt his wholesome condition. He knows that perfection in his activities depends on his progressive realization of Krsna consciousness. Sometimes, however, it may be seen that a person in Krsna consciousness commits some act which may be taken as most abominable socially or politically. But such a temporary falldown does not disqualify him. In the Srimad-Bhagavatam it is stated that if a person falls down but is wholeheartedly engaged in the transcendental service of the Supreme Lord, the Lord, being situated within his heart, purifies him and excuses him from that abomination. The material contamination is so strong that even a yogi fully engaged in the service of the Lord sometimes becomes ensnared; but Krsna consciousness is so strong that such an occasional falldown is at once rectified. Therefore the process of devotional service is always a success. No one should deride a devotee for some accidental falldown from the ideal path, for, as explained in the next verse, such occasional falldowns will be stopped in due course, as soon as a devotee is completely situated in Krsna consciousness.

Therefore a person who is situated in Krsna consciousness and is engaged with determination in the process of chanting Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare/ Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare should be considered to be in the transcendental position, even if by chance or accident he is found to have fallen. The words sadhur eva, “he is saintly,” are very emphatic. They are a warning to the nondevotees that because of an accidental falldown a devotee should not be derided; he should still be considered saintly even if he has accidentally fallen down. And the word mantavyah is still more emphatic. If one does not follow this rule, and derides a devotee for his accidental falldown, then one is disobeying the order of the Supreme Lord. The only qualification of a devotee is to be unflinchingly and exclusively engaged in devotional service.

In the Nrsimha Purana the following statement is given:

bhagavati ca harav ananya-ceta
bhrsa-malino ‘pi virajate manusyah
na hi sasa-kalusa-cchabih kadacit
timira-parabhavatam upaiti candrah

The meaning is that even if one fully engaged in the devotional service of the Lord is sometimes found engaged in abominable activities, these activities should be considered to be like the spots that resemble the mark of a rabbit on the moon. Such spots do not become an impediment to the diffusion of moonlight. Similarly, the accidental falldown of a devotee from the path of saintly character does not make him abominable.

On the other hand, one should not misunderstand that a devotee in transcendental devotional service can act in all kinds of abominable ways; this verse only refers to an accident due to the strong power of material connections. Devotional service is more or less a declaration of war against the illusory energy. As long as one is not strong enough to fight the illusory energy, there may be accidental falldowns. But when one is strong enough, he is no longer subjected to such falldowns, as previously explained. No one should take advantage of this verse and commit nonsense and think that he is still a devotee. If he does not improve in his character by devotional service, then it is to be understood that he is not a high devotee.

Can one who has sinned be a saint? (part 2)

Sometimes people think that once a person has performed sinful acts, especially acts that are grievously sinful, he must be regarded as a sinner forever. This notion runs contrary to Vaishnava philosophy.

In Bhagavad-gita (9.30–31) Lord Krishna says:

Even if one commits the most abominable action, if he is engaged in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated in his determination.

He quickly becomes righteous and attains lasting peace. O son of Kunti, declare it boldly that My devotee never perishes.

Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura comments on these verses as follows:

One might ask, “But if someone is corrupted by such bad behavior, how can he be a sadhu?”

This is answered: “He should be considered as such and thought of as a sadhu.” “He should be considered” is an injunctive statement. If this injunction is disobeyed, there will be unfavorable consequences. In other words, “The evidence for the truth of this is that it is simply My command.”

“Well,” someone might say, “one may be considered a sadhu partially, to the extent that he is worshiping You, but to the extent that he is usurping other men’s wives and property, he is not to be considered a sadhu.

This is answered by the word eva, only: “He should only be considered a sadhu, in all ways, completely.”

We should never view him as not a sadhu. His determination is completely fixed: “I may go to hell or obtain an animal birth because of my unavoidable sinful reactions, but I will never give up my exclusive worship of Sri Krsna.” Such determination is praiseworthy.

“But,” one might ask, “why do You accept the worship of such an irreligious person? Why do You consume the food and drink offered by one whose heart is contaminated by lust, anger, and other faults?”

In response the Lord says, “He quickly becomes religious.” This is not expressed as “He is going to quickly become” or “He will soon achieve peace.” Rather, the present tense is used: “he becomes” and “he attains.”

The Lord continues, “This means that immediately after he commits impiety, he remembers Me and feels remorse. He thus quickly becomes religious. He thinks, ‘Alas! Alas! There is no person more fallen than me. I defile the reputation of the community of devotees. Damn me!’ Again and again feeling remorse like this, he achieves complete peace and detachment.”

“Well,” one may say, “if he actually becomes religious, there can be no argument about such a person. But what about a devotee whose behavior is wicked and who fails to give up his bad behavior throughout his whole life? What can be said about him?”

Always affectionate to His devotees, the Lord responds to this doubt with complete confidence and with some anger, in the words beginning kaunteya: “My devotee never perishes. Even when he dies, he never falls down.”

To encourage Arjuna, who is disturbed with sorrow and apprehension over the thought that hard-hearted quibblers who indulge in false logic will not accept this, the Lord says, “O Kaunteya, go to the assembly of these disputants and, making a loud sound with drums and cymbals, raise your arms fearlessly and declare My promise: ‘I, Krsna, am the Supreme Lord, and even if My devotee is wicked in his behavior, he will never perish. On the contrary, such a devotee is sure to become successful.’ Their bad logic will be shattered by this confident declaration. They will certainly take shelter of you as their guru.” Such is the interpretation given by Sridhara Swami in his commentary.

Someone may ask, “But why doesn’t the Personality of Godhead Himself make this promise? Why does He instead deputize Arjuna to promise? In the same way as the Lord will later say, ‘Without a doubt you will come to Me. I promise you this because you are very dear to Me,’ why doesn’t He now say, ‘Kaunteya, I promise that My devotee will never perish’?”

Here is the answer. At that moment the Lord was thinking, “I am very affectionate to My devotees and cannot tolerate their being discredited at all. I will often break even My own promise and let Myself be discredited to protect My devotee’s promise. For example, I will soon fight with Bhisma and discard My own promise in order to protect Bhisma’s promise. Thus atheistic, logical quibblers will only laugh if I now offer My own promise, but they will have to acknowledge Arjuna’s promise as if it were written in stone. Therefore I will have Arjuna make this promise.”

Translation from Surrender Unto Me by Bhurijana Dasa (pages 206–208).


Can one who has sinned be a saint? (part 3)

Sometimes people think that once a person has performed sinful acts, especially acts that are grievously sinful, he must be regarded as a sinner forever. This notion runs contrary to Vaishnava philosophy.

The Brihad-vishnu Purana says:

namno hi yavati saktih
papa-nirharane hareh
tavat kartum na saknoti
patakam pataki narah

“Simply by chanting one holy name of Hari, a sinful man can counteract the reactions to more sins than he is able to commit.”

Can one who has sinned be a saint? (part 4)

Sometimes people think that once a person has performed sinful acts, especially acts that are grievously sinful, he must be regarded as a sinner forever. This notion runs contrary to Vaishnava philosophy.

In the book Surrender unto Me, Bhurijana Dasa comments on Bhagavad-gita 4.36–37, with references to the commentary of Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura.

36. Even if you are considered to be the most sinful of all sinners, when you are situated in the boat of transcendental knowledge you will be able to cross over the ocean of miseries.

In Chapter One, Arjuna feared sin and its resultant suffering. Krsna herein tells Arjuna the cure is transcendental knowledge, not fleeing the battlefield.

The words api cet (“even if”) are used when one accepts the occurrence of an unlikely or apparently self-contradictory event. Three questions could be asked, as posed by Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura: If someone is acting so sinfully, how can his heart become purified? And without such purification, how can he develop knowledge? And if he has developed knowledge, how can he act with such impropriety?

Krsna is thus describing this “api cet” situation to glorify the purifying effects of transcendental knowledge.

37.As a blazing fire turns firewood to ashes, O Arjuna, so does the fire of knowledge burn to ashes all reactions to material activities.

Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura comments: “Krsna says, ‘For one whose heart has become purified, I destroy completely whatever karma has already been generated with the exception of his parabdha-karma.’ ”

Transcendental knowledge thus destroys all reactions, both pious and sinful; all, that is, except prarabdha-karma, or matured reactions, such as one’s present material body.

Can one who has sinned be a saint? (part 5)

Sometimes people think that once a person has performed sinful acts, especially acts that are grievously sinful, he must be regarded as a sinner forever. This notion runs contrary to Vaishnava philosophy.

Several important quotations pertaining to this point appear in Chapter One of The Nectar of Devotion, “Characteristics of Pure Devotional Service,” in the section “Relief from Material Distress.” One such verse is Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.14.19, which Srila Prabhupada renders as follows:

“My dear Uddhava, devotional service unto Me is just like a blazing fire which can burn into ashes unlimited fuel supplied to it.”

Here are the Sanskrit and the translation and purport given for this verse by the disciples who completed his edition of Srimad-Bhagavatam:

yathagnih su-samrddharcih
karoty edhamsi bhasmasat
tatha mad-visaya bhaktir
uddhavainamsi krtsnasah

My dear Uddhava, just as a blazing fire turns firewood into ashes, similarly, devotion unto Me completely burns to ashes sins committed by My devotees.

PURPORT

One should carefully note that the Lord refers to devotion that is like a blazing fire. To commit sinful activity on the strength of chanting the holy name is the greatest offense, and the devotion of one who commits this offense cannot be compared to a blazing fire of love for Krsna.

As stated in the previous verse, a sincere loving devotee, because of immaturity or previous bad habits, may be disturbed by his senses even though he has accepted Lord Krsna as the only goal in his life. But if even by chance the devotee accidentally falls down without premeditation or indifference, the Lord immediately burns to ashes his sinful reactions, just as a blazing fire immediately consumes an insignificant piece of wood.

Lord Krsna is glorious, and one who takes exclusive shelter of the Lord receives the unique benefits of devotional service to the Supreme Personality of Godhead.

Can one who has sinned be a saint? (part 6)

Sometimes people think that once a person has performed sinful acts, especially acts that are grievously sinful, he must be regarded as a sinner forever. This notion runs contrary to Vaishnava philosophy.

We find relevant instructions in Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.5.42 (translated, with commentary, by disciples of Srila Prabhupada):

sva-pada-mulam bhajatah priyasya
tyaktanya-bhavasya harih paresah
vikarma yac cotpatitam kathancid
dhunoti sarvam hrdi sannivistah

One who has thus given up all other engagements and has taken full shelter at the lotus feet of Hari, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is very dear to the Lord. Indeed, if such a surrendered soul accidentally commits some sinful activity, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who is seated within everyone’s heart, immediately takes away the reaction to such sin.

PURPORT

In the previous verse [not included in this blog] it was clearly described that a fully surrendered devotee of the Supreme Lord has no need to perform ordinary, worldly duties. Now in this verse it is revealed that devotional service is so pure and potent that a surrendered devotee of the Lord has no need to perform any other purificatory process.

As described in the Sixth Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam, a surrendered devotee has no need to perform prayascitta, or atonement for an accidental falldown into sinful activity. Since devotional service is itself the most purifying process, a sincere devotee who has accidentally stumbled on the path should immediately resume his pure devotional service at the lotus feet of the Lord. And thus the Lord will protect him, as stated in Bhagavad-gita (9.30):

api cet su-duracaro
bhajate mam ananya-bhak
sadhur eva sa mantavyah
samyag vyavasito hi sah

The word tyaktanya-bhavasya in this verse is very significant. As stated in the previous verse, a pure devotee realizes clearly that all living entities, including Brahma and Siva, are part and parcel of the Supreme Personality of Godhead and thus have no separate or independent existence. Realizing that everything and everyone is part and parcel of the Lord, a devotee automatically is not inclined to commit sinful activities by violating the order of God.

However, due to the powerful influence of material nature, even a sincere devotee may be temporarily overwhelmed by illusion and deviate from the rigid path of pure devotional service. In such a case, Lord Krsna Himself, acting within the heart, removes such sinful activities.

Even Yamaraja, the lord of death, has no power to punish a surrendered devotee who has accidentally committed sinful activities. As stated here, Krsna is paresa, or the Supreme Lord, and all secondary lords such as the demigods cannot threaten the Lord’s personal devotees.

In his youth Ajamila had been a pious brahmana engaged in the service of the Lord. Then, by bad association with a prostitute, he became practically the most degraded man in the world. At the end of his life, Yamaraja sent his Yamadutas to drag away the soul of the sinful Ajamila, but the Personality of Godhead immediately sent His personal associates to save Ajamila and demonstrate to Yamaraja that no secondary personality can disturb the personal devotees of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. As stated in Bhagavad-gita, kaunteya pratijanihi na me bhaktah pranasyati..

The argument may be raised that the smrti-sastra states, sruti-smrti mamaivajne: the Vedic scriptures are the direct orders of the Personality of Godhead. Therefore, one may ask, how can the Lord tolerate that His orders be occasionally neglected, even by His devotees?

To answer this possible objection, the word priyasya is used in this verse. The devotees of the Lord are very dear to the Lord. Although the beloved child may accidentally commit an abominable activity, the loving father forgives the child, taking into consideration the actual good intentions of the child.

Thus, although the devotee of the Lord does not try to exploit the Lord’s mercy by requesting the Lord to free him from any future suffering, the Lord, by His own initiative, frees the devotee from the reactions to accidental falldowns.

This causeless mercy of the Lord upon His devotee is His paramaisvaryam, or supreme opulence. Gradually the faithful devotee becomes free, even from accidental falldown, because simply by remembering the lotus feet of the Lord, what to speak of by actively rendering service to Him, his heart is purified.

Although the surrendered devotees of the Personality of Godhead may sometimes appear to be affected by mundane attitudes, they are inevitably protected by the merciful Lord and are never actually defeated in life.

Can one who has sinned be a saint? (part 7)

Sometimes people think that once a person has performed sinful acts, especially acts that are grievously sinful, he must be regarded as a sinner forever. This notion runs contrary to Vaishnava philosophy.

As stated in Srimad-Bhagavatam (6.2.8–10) about the sinful Ajamila:

etenaiva hy aghono ’sya    krtam syad agha-niskrtam
yada narayanayeti    jagada catur-aksaram

stenah sura-po mitra-dhrug    brahma-ha guru-talpa-gah
stri-raja-pitr-go-hanta    ye ca patakino ’pare

sarvesam apy aghavatam    idam eva suniskrtam
nama-vyaharanam visnor    yatas tad-visaya matih

[The Visnudutas said] Even previously, while eating and at other times, this Ajamila would call his son, saying, “My dear Narayana, please come here.” Although calling the name of his son, he nevertheless uttered the four syllables na-ra-ya-na. Simply by chanting the name of Narayana in this way, he sufficiently atoned for the sinful reactions of millions of lives.

The chanting of the holy name of Lord Visnu is the best process of atonement for a thief of gold or other valuables, for a drunkard, for one who betrays a friend or relative, for one who kills a brahmana, or for one who indulges in sex with the wife of his guru or another superior.

It is also the best method of atonement for one who murders women, the king or his father, for one who slaughters cows, and for all other sinful men.

Simply by chanting the holy name of Lord Visnu, such sinful persons may attract the attention of the Supreme Lord, who therefore considers, “Because this man has chanted My holy name, My duty is to give him protection.”

An accidental falldown is one thing, but. . .

Must there not be some limit on how much we can forgive and excuse?

(A letter and reply)

 

Dear Jayadvaita Swami,

Re: Can one who has sinned be a saint?

Throughout our books and their purports the word “accidentally” is often used to describe the event for the “falldown” or “sin” of the devotee.

But what is written in purports about “intentionally” or the event where one says “I’m going to get out of this chair and go over there and ..”? And they get out of that chair intentionally over and over again to do their deeds. There must be some measured limit on the quality and quantity of sin for this “accidentally.”

I have forgiven my friends in the movement who “accidentally” have fallen down…

But I’m confused, as I am sure many others are, about the open door that is extended to “devotees” whose repeated evil acts were not one of sleeping with the whores, but of murder, racketeering, rape, and the intentional destruction of children’s minds and character.

These types of premeditated evil acts are very difficult for someone like me, who being in “the illusion” himself, has an impossible time seeing these acts as being committed by a devotee “temporarily overwhelmed by illusion.”

There must be some measured limit on the quality and quantity of sin for this “accidentally.”

Please illuminate me if you have time to respond. Thank you.

Regards,
Nityananda Rama


REPLY

 

Dear Nityananda Rama,

Thank you for your very pertinent question.

First of all, just to dispose of another issue before we get to the core philosophical question at hand:

We would benefit by reminding ourselves that the accounts we hear of evil deeds a devotee has performed are often seriously unreliable or verifiably exaggerated or false.

Leaving deliberate lying and truth-stretching aside, the work of Elizabeth Loftus and other researchers investigating how memory works has shown that memory can be notoriously bad. Even when people sincerely intend to tell the truth their memory can be influenced by all sorts of variables—their complex inner feelings, the way questions are worded, the expectations of authorities and peers—and this can put their testimony at odds with objectively verifiable facts.

Sometimes we hear a deeply affecting story, unaware that others present at the time of the event have given a very different picture, or that important features of the story—features likely to give us a very different impression—have been left out.

Of course, what we hear may often be accurate and true. But lots of what we hear simply isn’t.

Now, on to your question.

Throughout our books and their purports the word “accidentally” is often used to describe the event for the “falldown” or “sin” of the devotee.

But what is written in purports about “intentionally” or the event where one says “I´m going to get out of this chair and go over there and ..”? And they get out of that chair intentionally over and over again to do their deeds. There must be some measured limit on the quality and quantity of sin for this “accidentally”…

I’m confused, as I am sure many others are, about the open door that is extended to “devotees” whose repeated evil acts were not one of sleeping with the whores, but of murder, racketeering, rape, and the intentional destruction of children’s minds and character.

These types of premeditated evil acts are very difficult for someone like me, who being in “the illusion” himself, has an impossible time seeing these acts as being committed by a devotee “temporarily overwhelmed by illusion.”

There must be some measured limit on the quality and quantity of sin for this “accidentally.”

First, let’s look at “accidentally” and “intentionally.”

Sometimes we may commit a sin with no intention of doing so and without even knowing it. For example, we might offer polluted food to a saint, not knowing that the food had been polluted. Or while serving as a policeman we might accidentally shoot the wrong man. This is what we might call “purely accidental.”

Then again, there are sins we commit in the course of our profession. Srila Prabhupada gives the examples of the brahmana who performs animal sacrifices, the merchant who lies, and the sudra who serves the orders of a bad master.

Sometimes we do what we think is right—we are acting intentionally—but it later turns out wrong. In many districts of West Bengal, international welfare workers dug wells that have now turned out to be the cause of a huge epidemic of arsenic-induced disease. The work was intended, the harm was not. And yet the work has caused terrible suffering for thousands of people.

Then there are sins we commit not because we don’t know what we’re doing but because, even though we know, we lose control of ourselves. We know that drinking liquor is sinful, but someone invites us to have a drink, and because of a past habit we go for it. Or we know that illicit sex is sinful, but still, dragged by lust, we go visit a prostitute.

As mentioned by Arjuna in Bhagavad-gita (3.36), anicchann api varsneya balad iva niyojitah: Even without wishing to do so, one may commit a sin, as if forced. And Krsna tells Arjuna that this is due to the power of lust.

Would you call this kind of sin “accidental” or “intentional”? From one point of view, it’s accidental. One doesn’t *want* to sin, but somehow one feels overwhelmed. On the other hand, the sin is performed knowingly, and with some features of intentionality also. One picks up the glass with the intention of drinking it. One visits the prostitute with the intention of having sex with her.

And, by the power of lust, one may do this again and again, all the while knowing it’s wrong and all the while wishing one were strong enough to overcome one’s sinful desires.

So sin is messy business. We know there is a difference between sins committed “accidentally” and those committed “intentionally.” And we’d like to divide sin easily into neat categories of “intentional” and “accidental.” But it may not divide so easily.

Nonetheless: Whatever sins one may have committed—accidentally or intentionally—can be nullified by pure devotional service, and especially by the chanting of the holy name. Our scriptures declare this again and again.

namno hi yavati saktih
papa-nirharane hareh
tavat kartum na saknoti
patakam pataki narah

“Simply by chanting one holy name of Hari, a sinful man can counteract the reactions to more sins than he is able to commit.” (Brhad-visnu Purana)

As stated here, there is no limit to the sins that can be eradicated by the power of the holy name of the Lord.

Similarly, Krsna says in Bhagavad-gita (4.36):

api ced asi papebhyah
sarvebhyah papa-krt-tamah
sarvam jnana-plavenaiva
vrjinam santarisyasi

“Even if you are considered the most sinful of all sinners, when you are situated in the boat of transcendental knowledge you will be able to cross over the ocean of miseries.”

Who can be delivered? Not just the somewhat sinful, or the occasionally sinful, or even the very sinful, but “the most sinful of all sinners.”

As Krsna says in Bhagavad-gita (9.30):

api cet su-duracaro
bhajate mam ananya-bhak
sadhur eva sa mantavyah
samyag vyavasito hi sah

“Even if one commits the most abominable action, if he is engaged in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated in his determination.”

ksipram bhavati dharmatma
sasvac-chantim nigacchati
kaunteya pratijanihi
na me bhaktah pranasyati

“He quickly becomes righteous and attains lasting peace. O son of Kunti, declare it boldly that My devotee never perishes.”

But one point Srila Prabhupada stresses again and again: To commit sins with the notion that one can nullify their reactions by chanting the holy name is the worst of offenses. The sinful person who thinks he can get away with sinful life by chanting the holy name is entirely different from the person who commits sins, regrets them, and finally becomes saintly in his behavior.

Even if a devotee has acted abominably, if he remains fixed in devotional service and does not try to use the holy name of the Lord as an instrument for justifying his sins, he has to be regarded as a saintly person.

The scriptures say so.

      Jayadvaita Swami

More about Saints and Sinners

This past week in Vrindaban, one of my godbrothers reminded me of this verse from Srimad-Bhagavatam (11.5.42):

sva-pada-mulam bhajatah priyasya
tyaktanya-bhavasya harih paresah
vikarma yac cotpatitam kathancid
dhunoti sarvam hrdi sannivistah

“One who has given up everything and taken full shelter at the lotus feet of Hari, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is very dear to the Lord. Therefore, if such a surrendered soul accidentally commits some sinful acts, the Lord, who is seated within everyone’s heart, at once takes away the reaction to such sins.”

The leaders of any Vaishnava spiritual society need to be aware of this instruction.